大立光股價暴跌4成,市值獲利全輸中國舜 - 工程師
By Hedwig
at 2021-10-22T14:03
at 2021-10-22T14:03
Table of Contents
※ 引述《sendtony6 (遊民)》之銘言:
: 再說了 手機鏡頭本來就沒有那麼難做
: 事實證明,對岸有心也能做
: 賺了10年時間跟資源結果頂多只是擴產 也沒看到投資新產業 更沒看到照顧員工
: 不要怪人家蘋果扶植對手,套句慣老闆最常說的話:是你自己不爭氣
小弟這個領域相關的人員,但不是光學
出來拋磚引玉
業內的人也可以多分享一下
大立光這個公司雖然股價這樣跌
但是他第二季毛利還是在60 %
對於一個精密機械工業的公司來說
還是天文數字的強
這一點大家還是要記得
雖然舜宇已經拿到很多主要鏡頭的訂單
但是高階鏡頭還是要找大立光
只是華為被打之後高階鏡頭量真的變少
大家現在看到的中國品牌
他們的旗艦機其實出貨都非常的少
中低階價格的機種才是主力
這種等級的舜宇就沒問題了
一個前相機整組大概兩三塊美金就有
大立光一個高階鏡頭就4-5塊錢以上
你可以想像$10,000的手機
成本最多抓個$4000
根本用不起台幣150多塊錢的鏡頭(一顆
還不含sensor對焦馬達還有軟板
組裝也有良率和費用
這麼貴的一個鏡頭只有高階手機用的起
對於BOM review來講根本就是一塊肥肉
當然是各品牌get the cost down的重點
所以有龐大生產優勢的中國廠商就有實力
反正我低價殺進去
採購和大老闆叫你用,
不太如預期
最後你的工程師還不是量產前要放規格?
(相信很多系統廠的工程師能感同身受)
其實到現在為止我還是覺得大立光強
但是中國價格實在是太香了,
一點都沒有一線廠的架子
而且出貨量就在那邊
老闆一句,
別人都能大量出貨我們為什麼不敢用
工程師即使有什麼意見也就閉嘴了
韓廠日廠這幾年一樣被打趴
舜宇成為三星的主力供應商,韓系鏡頭當然也會受到影響,不是只有台灣
回到大立光,
三年前有一個小弟的學弟來問我說
他在台中要找光學的工作是不是去大立光
看板上的討論這麼可怕
我說光學你想繼續走下去
就走大立光就對了,去熬個三年出來
後來他出來,真的就像我說的外商隨便挑
當然可能是因為學弟他特別努力
大立光也不一定是外商保證班
但這裡講他們的技術的確還是很多人要的。
大立光之所以股價讓大家失去成長的想像
推文有人提到了重點,
第一個當然是華為倒台,沒什麼人要8P以上高階的鏡頭。
這個討論串第一篇的新聞有提到,大立光的良率可以到八成,他們猛的地方是在於說高階鏡
尺寸的誤差都是在微米等級,這個是塑膠模具超精密加工最難的地方。
一個鏡片假設一模12穴,出來會有12種狀況的鏡片。
略懂良率直通率的人,就知道把每一片的良率乘起來再加上這麼多的組合,做到多片鏡頭的良
率就很挑戰了。
還要到八成為簡直要跪著拿了。如果你今年開發一個旗艦手機要出上百萬顆,你當然找大立
光,最後出的來。總不能量產被一顆鏡頭卡住。如果找中國公司,可能最後良率搞死你,便
秘出不來就完了。
不過你看到這邊一定想到,如果中國廠商來給你半價出貨,一顆出不了貨你不會出兩顆?良率
只有四成那我就生產兩倍,放一點規格一樣可以出貨,所以有辦法用低價競爭的中國公司就
有優勢。
2018年公司派我去看中國的主力鏡頭廠,我有到他們產線上。那個時候餘姚的舜宇光學廠剛蓋
好
他們的產線一望無際,這麼大的鏡頭工廠第一次見到。十幾條線一字排開。
不過他們的工程師大家也不要覺得待遇很好
過幾年就跳槽的人很多,不過現在公司高速發展,大家都是靠分紅在那邊撐
有這樣的對手當然是很難纏。但我覺得從技術面來講大立光還沒有過時。車用鏡頭現在回來弄
也不晚。只是車用鏡頭的解析度一般不高,所以專做車用鏡頭更便宜更有競爭力的公司很多
。
是不是未來車用鏡頭的品質要提升還要再觀察。
第二個重點就是防手振和變焦馬達
這裡面沒有提到是三星的變焦馬達
未來應該是一個主力
三星能夠從鏡頭到馬達整個整合設計
變成說你買它的對焦馬達
就要搭配他的鏡頭
這個在未來的高階機種是一個方向
這個大立光前幾年就在做了
只是對焦馬達的技術似乎還沒到一流
做玻璃鏡片塑膠鏡片的知識
沒辦法拿到對焦馬達
需要控制金屬加工甚至陶瓷加工這些專長
舜宇也有在投資這塊
大家可以想想
為什麼要用到七八片鏡頭?
因為光圈要大,鏡頭多片才設計的出來
光圈大進光量大
夜間照片才會漂亮
但是某搜尋引擎公司殺進來
計算攝影出現之後
全部人都在開發算法,完全突破鏡頭的限制,一點點光就可以達到足夠的曝光
手機的進光量變得不重要
防手振才是最重要
所以雲台,感測器補償,
更大更快的對焦馬達
才是下一個世代的重點
所以真正要能夠彎道超車
就是看大家防手震這一塊做到什麼程度
不過這塊水蠻深的啦
以上個人淺見,拋磚引玉
--
Sent from nPTT on my iPhone 12 Pro
--
: 再說了 手機鏡頭本來就沒有那麼難做
: 事實證明,對岸有心也能做
: 賺了10年時間跟資源結果頂多只是擴產 也沒看到投資新產業 更沒看到照顧員工
: 不要怪人家蘋果扶植對手,套句慣老闆最常說的話:是你自己不爭氣
小弟這個領域相關的人員,但不是光學
出來拋磚引玉
業內的人也可以多分享一下
大立光這個公司雖然股價這樣跌
但是他第二季毛利還是在60 %
對於一個精密機械工業的公司來說
還是天文數字的強
這一點大家還是要記得
雖然舜宇已經拿到很多主要鏡頭的訂單
但是高階鏡頭還是要找大立光
只是華為被打之後高階鏡頭量真的變少
大家現在看到的中國品牌
他們的旗艦機其實出貨都非常的少
中低階價格的機種才是主力
這種等級的舜宇就沒問題了
一個前相機整組大概兩三塊美金就有
大立光一個高階鏡頭就4-5塊錢以上
你可以想像$10,000的手機
成本最多抓個$4000
根本用不起台幣150多塊錢的鏡頭(一顆
還不含sensor對焦馬達還有軟板
組裝也有良率和費用
這麼貴的一個鏡頭只有高階手機用的起
對於BOM review來講根本就是一塊肥肉
當然是各品牌get the cost down的重點
所以有龐大生產優勢的中國廠商就有實力
反正我低價殺進去
採購和大老闆叫你用,
不太如預期
最後你的工程師還不是量產前要放規格?
(相信很多系統廠的工程師能感同身受)
其實到現在為止我還是覺得大立光強
但是中國價格實在是太香了,
一點都沒有一線廠的架子
而且出貨量就在那邊
老闆一句,
別人都能大量出貨我們為什麼不敢用
工程師即使有什麼意見也就閉嘴了
韓廠日廠這幾年一樣被打趴
舜宇成為三星的主力供應商,韓系鏡頭當然也會受到影響,不是只有台灣
回到大立光,
三年前有一個小弟的學弟來問我說
他在台中要找光學的工作是不是去大立光
看板上的討論這麼可怕
我說光學你想繼續走下去
就走大立光就對了,去熬個三年出來
後來他出來,真的就像我說的外商隨便挑
當然可能是因為學弟他特別努力
大立光也不一定是外商保證班
但這裡講他們的技術的確還是很多人要的。
大立光之所以股價讓大家失去成長的想像
推文有人提到了重點,
第一個當然是華為倒台,沒什麼人要8P以上高階的鏡頭。
這個討論串第一篇的新聞有提到,大立光的良率可以到八成,他們猛的地方是在於說高階鏡
尺寸的誤差都是在微米等級,這個是塑膠模具超精密加工最難的地方。
一個鏡片假設一模12穴,出來會有12種狀況的鏡片。
略懂良率直通率的人,就知道把每一片的良率乘起來再加上這麼多的組合,做到多片鏡頭的良
率就很挑戰了。
還要到八成為簡直要跪著拿了。如果你今年開發一個旗艦手機要出上百萬顆,你當然找大立
光,最後出的來。總不能量產被一顆鏡頭卡住。如果找中國公司,可能最後良率搞死你,便
秘出不來就完了。
不過你看到這邊一定想到,如果中國廠商來給你半價出貨,一顆出不了貨你不會出兩顆?良率
只有四成那我就生產兩倍,放一點規格一樣可以出貨,所以有辦法用低價競爭的中國公司就
有優勢。
2018年公司派我去看中國的主力鏡頭廠,我有到他們產線上。那個時候餘姚的舜宇光學廠剛蓋
好
他們的產線一望無際,這麼大的鏡頭工廠第一次見到。十幾條線一字排開。
不過他們的工程師大家也不要覺得待遇很好
過幾年就跳槽的人很多,不過現在公司高速發展,大家都是靠分紅在那邊撐
有這樣的對手當然是很難纏。但我覺得從技術面來講大立光還沒有過時。車用鏡頭現在回來弄
也不晚。只是車用鏡頭的解析度一般不高,所以專做車用鏡頭更便宜更有競爭力的公司很多
。
是不是未來車用鏡頭的品質要提升還要再觀察。
第二個重點就是防手振和變焦馬達
這裡面沒有提到是三星的變焦馬達
未來應該是一個主力
三星能夠從鏡頭到馬達整個整合設計
變成說你買它的對焦馬達
就要搭配他的鏡頭
這個在未來的高階機種是一個方向
這個大立光前幾年就在做了
只是對焦馬達的技術似乎還沒到一流
做玻璃鏡片塑膠鏡片的知識
沒辦法拿到對焦馬達
需要控制金屬加工甚至陶瓷加工這些專長
舜宇也有在投資這塊
大家可以想想
為什麼要用到七八片鏡頭?
因為光圈要大,鏡頭多片才設計的出來
光圈大進光量大
夜間照片才會漂亮
但是某搜尋引擎公司殺進來
計算攝影出現之後
全部人都在開發算法,完全突破鏡頭的限制,一點點光就可以達到足夠的曝光
手機的進光量變得不重要
防手振才是最重要
所以雲台,感測器補償,
更大更快的對焦馬達
才是下一個世代的重點
所以真正要能夠彎道超車
就是看大家防手震這一塊做到什麼程度
不過這塊水蠻深的啦
以上個人淺見,拋磚引玉
--
Sent from nPTT on my iPhone 12 Pro
--
Tags:
工程師
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