這樣的薪水跟機會該去廣州嗎? - 工程師
By Mary
at 2023-04-16T17:15
at 2023-04-16T17:15
Table of Contents
看到這系列文忍不住想分享一下自身基層工程師的經歷:
身為一個112純血(物理系/光電所)工作了五年多的前台積整合工程師,因為個人健康因素裸
辭,打算找個相對自由和輕鬆不用輪班和on call的design house PE之類的職
缺,目標一年能有個1.5M~2M左右每年能有假期出國兩三次
(未婚無房,基本屬於半躺平,不太願意為了高薪犧牲生活,追求WLB)
但是歷經長達半年找工作的碰壁,加上長輩紛紛告誡待業太久會喪失競爭力,
因此陰錯陽差接受了中國某H公司主動邀約的新Fab PIE offer
因為此公司目前被封殺,所以當初面試一切都是保密狀態下進行
(工作地點環境未知,以前也沒了解過中國的詳細情況,完全是被動) 但是因為個人當時
失業焦慮加上HR的大餅(7X~80W年薪/月薪4W5 RMB/無股權分紅)只能勉為
其難地抱著先求有想法來中國工作,但是入職之後簽工作合同就發現很多規定
其實跟當初認為有很大的差別 (合約中返台機票配額須滿一年才有,8天合同年
休假請了會扣薪水跟影響考勤係數,年終和升遷會優先考量此係數),拿到的17
職等相較年資更少的其他台灣人更低 (這部份個人因素較大,因為當初本就沒
有來中國的計畫,沒詳細了解合理範圍和爭取談判,算是學個教訓,不過我
應該是台籍最低的職等,其他人都談得比較好) 報到之後得知需先在上海Base待
一到兩個月,此時與其他同來的交談才知道基本都有給予公司宿舍或是租房補助
(當然本人沒有須自行解決,可能職等較低也有影響,當初面試有談到工作地是有
附住宿跟接駁車,當初沒被告知會需要先待在上海所以根本也沒談到這部分)
後來外派到此公司轉投資的Foundry(山東的新建廠),發現公司地點非常偏
僻,餐廳更是完全無法適應(這時候發覺原來GG的餐廳比較起來跟天堂一樣)
外派分配的住宿離公司通勤時間需要50分鐘左右,都要七點左右出門蠻累得
試用期長達半年,期間除了月末加班補休之外並沒有半天假(除了輪班沒有996)
,當然公司有給每個月兩次往返住家來回機票(中國本土)和每天200出差費
(這對於本地員工是不錯的福利,但是對台籍員工就算是比較雞肋的存在)
而且上海base跟同樣深圳base來的員工,個人所得稅扣得多不少
加上大陸稅的確比台灣重,稅後大概只能領到八成左右
Fab這邊基本上老闆都是台籍居多,雖然有些使用GG FAB的管理方式覺得有
點太過over,但是整體而言還是偏GG RD風氣居多,只是不知道是不是中國公
司的天性,這邊產品開發時程比GG開發時程還要短很多,基本一到兩年就要
量產(目前算是最簡單的FinFET node,但是在機台和系統運作都草創的時期我是
覺得有點太過急切,更不用說其他Foundry更先進的專案開發時間基本一樣,
在tool基本上都是二手貨不然就是極度缺乏(基本買不到,需使用中國自產)),
很懷疑未來往後幾代的產品開發是否能順利? 雖然本人一直抱著騎驢找馬的心
態,Linkedin & 104都持續投遞 (當然目前的確是比較凍,短時間內能否登出
尚未可知,希望運氣能眷顧在下)。當然我本身就是沒有打聽和深思熟慮就過來
中國工作的,所以的確是吃了不少虧,這個部份我個人因素比較大。在這邊目
前就是一樣當個基層的整合工程師,抱著多學多看的心態佛系工作,等待運氣
降臨轉身登出。(基本已經把獎金那些當作不存在的東西)
其實當初再來之前還是有再嘗試找PE的職缺,只是2022下半年之後明顯更難找
當時已經搬回家裡父母也是對我的情況感到很擔憂,勸我有工作就先接受,
當時自己也很徬徨不知道在景氣轉差的情況下要不要繼續找還是先放棄目標
為了生活屈就,最終只能抱著嘗試看看的心態赴陸(有時候人總會為五斗米折腰)
總結赴陸新手來中國這邊晶圓製造領域工作的感想:
1. 目前Foundry的確是這邊最火的產業,詢問本地員工得知薪水基本上是當地
能找到最好的待遇(而且目前中國各省都有一堆計畫,目前linkedin持續收到中
國hunter & HR的詢問,但是因為個人意願問題暫時都pass),我覺得假如有拿
到管理職位有發展潛力可以過來嘗試,但是假如跟我一樣拿到基層的職缺我覺
得可以不用過來,因為你的本地同事大部分都是博士,而且中國人普遍真的蠻
奴的,內卷情況下要跟他們競爭對我而言很辛苦(這邊加班基本沒有加班費,而
且中國人好像覺得錢給夠就好,完全不需要休息可以一直打拼,實在跟我的價
值觀差異太大,當然在GG也有這種人,因人而異自行判斷)
2. 跟當地員工言談可以得知中國人普遍跟台籍的價值觀和國際觀有較大的落差
,當然在這邊台籍人士最好少表達政治,跟著附和或是不講話比較好,
但是這方面跟有無出國留學過有很大程度的改善 (這邊出國比例真的偏低)
(不得不承認共產黨在民族主義的培養和控制資訊思想方面絕對是大師級別的)
如果公司高層都是台籍居多我覺得來工作相對比較安全,不然其實對中國人而
言除非你真的很厲害不然台籍先天長期下來就競爭不過本土。而且目前我
真的無法確定基層的工程師在中美對抗環境下來大陸工作是否真的會影響回台
的機會和待遇,對我這種沒有打算在中國長期發展的來說這個是高風險的因素
3. 生活方面的確中國的APP非常方便,基本可以完成生活中大小瑣事,但是
在實際生活體驗方面則台灣還是好很多,中國表面上高樓商場地鐵林立,但是
實際使用會發覺路上基本常常不平整,常常有髒汙積水或是施工,居民樓內燈
光昏暗牆壁剝落,不知是否跟缺乏維護還是施工品質有關,交通方面假如
台灣叫行人地獄,那相信我中國絕對是18層地獄(上海稍微好點,二線城市
基本都叫人大開眼界),加上沿海城市人口密度極高,一到假日基本上想去景點
旅遊體驗基本不會太好,一到連假基本不能去有名的景點(除非你想體驗被人推
著走的滋味,中國自然風景的確是世界級別的就是人真的太多~扣分太大)
4. 人均素質說實在話還是有待提升,尤其是社會較為底層的基本上少計較不然
徒然生氣,而且普遍有莫名的民族優越感,感覺心裡也是把台灣當成外人
(我也是這樣看他們的,所以基本兩邊覺得實質上就是不同的國家),而且城鄉差
距極大不說,就算北上廣深跟二三線城市各方面也會有明顯的差別,在城市會
有大量的各地漂來的領著低薪的打工族,詐騙感覺比台灣還多,辦門號之後高
頻率收到莫名的詐騙電話和訊息。平時消費也充斥著各種套路。
暫時想到這些,可能講得有點多,不過也只是個人經歷的心得體會,每個人都
有不同的個性和追求,很多本人的主觀意見僅供參考,還是要以自己的需求為
出發點
P.S. 現在其實內心也是會後悔離開GG的,因為發現去年整包好像比我在這邊
扣完稅拿的還要多,不過人生就是這樣總要為自己的決定負責,就算是錯誤的
選擇也要從中學習到教訓才可以避免重蹈覆轍。加上在GG前幾年的確薪水大概就
落在1.5M~1.8M左右,爆發第一年因為個人JOS原因原部門直接送S-所以
其實少了很多,所以當時談薪水要在往上也遇到障礙(須提供過往薪資證明)
事後來看的確在錯誤的時間點作出選擇~但是當時身心出現狀況需要靠藥物幫助
也是沒有撐過去就登出了QQ
--
身為一個112純血(物理系/光電所)工作了五年多的前台積整合工程師,因為個人健康因素裸
辭,打算找個相對自由和輕鬆不用輪班和on call的design house PE之類的職
缺,目標一年能有個1.5M~2M左右每年能有假期出國兩三次
(未婚無房,基本屬於半躺平,不太願意為了高薪犧牲生活,追求WLB)
但是歷經長達半年找工作的碰壁,加上長輩紛紛告誡待業太久會喪失競爭力,
因此陰錯陽差接受了中國某H公司主動邀約的新Fab PIE offer
因為此公司目前被封殺,所以當初面試一切都是保密狀態下進行
(工作地點環境未知,以前也沒了解過中國的詳細情況,完全是被動) 但是因為個人當時
失業焦慮加上HR的大餅(7X~80W年薪/月薪4W5 RMB/無股權分紅)只能勉為
其難地抱著先求有想法來中國工作,但是入職之後簽工作合同就發現很多規定
其實跟當初認為有很大的差別 (合約中返台機票配額須滿一年才有,8天合同年
休假請了會扣薪水跟影響考勤係數,年終和升遷會優先考量此係數),拿到的17
職等相較年資更少的其他台灣人更低 (這部份個人因素較大,因為當初本就沒
有來中國的計畫,沒詳細了解合理範圍和爭取談判,算是學個教訓,不過我
應該是台籍最低的職等,其他人都談得比較好) 報到之後得知需先在上海Base待
一到兩個月,此時與其他同來的交談才知道基本都有給予公司宿舍或是租房補助
(當然本人沒有須自行解決,可能職等較低也有影響,當初面試有談到工作地是有
附住宿跟接駁車,當初沒被告知會需要先待在上海所以根本也沒談到這部分)
後來外派到此公司轉投資的Foundry(山東的新建廠),發現公司地點非常偏
僻,餐廳更是完全無法適應(這時候發覺原來GG的餐廳比較起來跟天堂一樣)
外派分配的住宿離公司通勤時間需要50分鐘左右,都要七點左右出門蠻累得
試用期長達半年,期間除了月末加班補休之外並沒有半天假(除了輪班沒有996)
,當然公司有給每個月兩次往返住家來回機票(中國本土)和每天200出差費
(這對於本地員工是不錯的福利,但是對台籍員工就算是比較雞肋的存在)
而且上海base跟同樣深圳base來的員工,個人所得稅扣得多不少
加上大陸稅的確比台灣重,稅後大概只能領到八成左右
Fab這邊基本上老闆都是台籍居多,雖然有些使用GG FAB的管理方式覺得有
點太過over,但是整體而言還是偏GG RD風氣居多,只是不知道是不是中國公
司的天性,這邊產品開發時程比GG開發時程還要短很多,基本一到兩年就要
量產(目前算是最簡單的FinFET node,但是在機台和系統運作都草創的時期我是
覺得有點太過急切,更不用說其他Foundry更先進的專案開發時間基本一樣,
在tool基本上都是二手貨不然就是極度缺乏(基本買不到,需使用中國自產)),
很懷疑未來往後幾代的產品開發是否能順利? 雖然本人一直抱著騎驢找馬的心
態,Linkedin & 104都持續投遞 (當然目前的確是比較凍,短時間內能否登出
尚未可知,希望運氣能眷顧在下)。當然我本身就是沒有打聽和深思熟慮就過來
中國工作的,所以的確是吃了不少虧,這個部份我個人因素比較大。在這邊目
前就是一樣當個基層的整合工程師,抱著多學多看的心態佛系工作,等待運氣
降臨轉身登出。(基本已經把獎金那些當作不存在的東西)
其實當初再來之前還是有再嘗試找PE的職缺,只是2022下半年之後明顯更難找
當時已經搬回家裡父母也是對我的情況感到很擔憂,勸我有工作就先接受,
當時自己也很徬徨不知道在景氣轉差的情況下要不要繼續找還是先放棄目標
為了生活屈就,最終只能抱著嘗試看看的心態赴陸(有時候人總會為五斗米折腰)
總結赴陸新手來中國這邊晶圓製造領域工作的感想:
1. 目前Foundry的確是這邊最火的產業,詢問本地員工得知薪水基本上是當地
能找到最好的待遇(而且目前中國各省都有一堆計畫,目前linkedin持續收到中
國hunter & HR的詢問,但是因為個人意願問題暫時都pass),我覺得假如有拿
到管理職位有發展潛力可以過來嘗試,但是假如跟我一樣拿到基層的職缺我覺
得可以不用過來,因為你的本地同事大部分都是博士,而且中國人普遍真的蠻
奴的,內卷情況下要跟他們競爭對我而言很辛苦(這邊加班基本沒有加班費,而
且中國人好像覺得錢給夠就好,完全不需要休息可以一直打拼,實在跟我的價
值觀差異太大,當然在GG也有這種人,因人而異自行判斷)
2. 跟當地員工言談可以得知中國人普遍跟台籍的價值觀和國際觀有較大的落差
,當然在這邊台籍人士最好少表達政治,跟著附和或是不講話比較好,
但是這方面跟有無出國留學過有很大程度的改善 (這邊出國比例真的偏低)
(不得不承認共產黨在民族主義的培養和控制資訊思想方面絕對是大師級別的)
如果公司高層都是台籍居多我覺得來工作相對比較安全,不然其實對中國人而
言除非你真的很厲害不然台籍先天長期下來就競爭不過本土。而且目前我
真的無法確定基層的工程師在中美對抗環境下來大陸工作是否真的會影響回台
的機會和待遇,對我這種沒有打算在中國長期發展的來說這個是高風險的因素
3. 生活方面的確中國的APP非常方便,基本可以完成生活中大小瑣事,但是
在實際生活體驗方面則台灣還是好很多,中國表面上高樓商場地鐵林立,但是
實際使用會發覺路上基本常常不平整,常常有髒汙積水或是施工,居民樓內燈
光昏暗牆壁剝落,不知是否跟缺乏維護還是施工品質有關,交通方面假如
台灣叫行人地獄,那相信我中國絕對是18層地獄(上海稍微好點,二線城市
基本都叫人大開眼界),加上沿海城市人口密度極高,一到假日基本上想去景點
旅遊體驗基本不會太好,一到連假基本不能去有名的景點(除非你想體驗被人推
著走的滋味,中國自然風景的確是世界級別的就是人真的太多~扣分太大)
4. 人均素質說實在話還是有待提升,尤其是社會較為底層的基本上少計較不然
徒然生氣,而且普遍有莫名的民族優越感,感覺心裡也是把台灣當成外人
(我也是這樣看他們的,所以基本兩邊覺得實質上就是不同的國家),而且城鄉差
距極大不說,就算北上廣深跟二三線城市各方面也會有明顯的差別,在城市會
有大量的各地漂來的領著低薪的打工族,詐騙感覺比台灣還多,辦門號之後高
頻率收到莫名的詐騙電話和訊息。平時消費也充斥著各種套路。
暫時想到這些,可能講得有點多,不過也只是個人經歷的心得體會,每個人都
有不同的個性和追求,很多本人的主觀意見僅供參考,還是要以自己的需求為
出發點
P.S. 現在其實內心也是會後悔離開GG的,因為發現去年整包好像比我在這邊
扣完稅拿的還要多,不過人生就是這樣總要為自己的決定負責,就算是錯誤的
選擇也要從中學習到教訓才可以避免重蹈覆轍。加上在GG前幾年的確薪水大概就
落在1.5M~1.8M左右,爆發第一年因為個人JOS原因原部門直接送S-所以
其實少了很多,所以當時談薪水要在往上也遇到障礙(須提供過往薪資證明)
事後來看的確在錯誤的時間點作出選擇~但是當時身心出現狀況需要靠藥物幫助
也是沒有撐過去就登出了QQ
--
All Comments
By David
at 2023-04-15T13:15
at 2023-04-15T13:15
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at 2023-04-18T22:16
at 2023-04-18T22:16
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at 2023-04-15T13:15
at 2023-04-15T13:15
By Megan
at 2023-04-18T22:16
at 2023-04-18T22:16
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